Tackling My First Popcorn/stucco Ceilings Over Plaster.....

[Bster13]

Hello Everyone,

I'm a new to this game (have painted mostly as well as put up drywall on walls in new construction as well as small repairs). I'm tackling my first set of popcorn/stucco over plaster ceilings in a one story ranch built in the 1950s. The Stucco is THINK, but the the popcorn is "normal."

Underneath all that goodness is plaster ceilings with hairline cracks everywhere.

Options (I think) to address this after stripping down to the plaster:

1) Skim coat. (NOT RECOMMENDED. It'd be fast but the cracks in the underlying plaster will just come through the skim coat eventually and I'll have to go back and fix it....repeatedly.)

2) Use wide mesh tape and then skim coat over. This will give a buffer between the cracked plaster and the new skim coat so the cracks won't come back.

3) Don't completely remove popcorn/stucco ceilings, but just knock them down a bit then screw drywall ( 1/2" or 5/8” thick) into ceiling joists, then tape and mud.

I haven't priced out the drywall yet or jacks but I may just make my own deadmans, but here are my questions:

- Which repair will last the longest?

- What type of repair will take the longest to complete? (hanging drywall vs. scraping/sanding popcorn/stucco)

- Are there any "gotchas" I am not thinking of?

Many thanks.

[pushkins]

Knocking down the popcorn (ideally it should be removed) and installing new drywall over the top is the permanent fix and probably the quickest as well.
Use 1/2" drywall screwed every 12", this will require taping all wall to ceiling corners, so you will be up for a new wall painting as well. 1/2" drywall is around the $8/sheet (32 sq. feet), make your life easy and hire a drywall lift if your doing it single handed it will save your hours of time, sheets of drywall and bottles of ibuprofen A drywall lift should rent out for around $60/day.

Wide tape would require a whole ceiling skim coat and there are no guarantees old cracks won't reappear or new ones in the plaster (which is apt to crack) show up.

[Bster13]

Many thanks you rock... Drywall it is. That "guarantee" part is mighty important.

Knocking down the popcorn (ideally it should be removed) and installing new drywall over the top is the permanent fix and probably the quickest as well.
Use 1/2" drywall screwed every 12", this will require taping all wall to ceiling corners, so you will be up for a new wall painting as well. 1/2" drywall is around the $8/sheet (32 sq. feet), make your life easy and hire a drywall lift if your doing it single handed it will save your hours of time, sheets of drywall and bottles of ibuprofen A drywall lift should rent out for around $60/day.

Wide tape would require a whole ceiling skim coat and there are no guarantees old cracks won't reappear or new ones in the plaster (which is apt to crack) show up.

[Bster13]

And I think I am going to go with thinner drywall than 1/2in, that's a lot of weight on the ceiling joists when there is already a plaster ceiling above it, no?

[pushkins]

It isn't a normal area that you would use 3/8" or 1/4" drywall for a ceiling, the problem is that it's too thin to hold onto the screws with 100% of it's weight (on walls it's on edge and has lateral hold on the screws), plus it's far less forgiving when screwed onto an uneven surface, the thin drywall tends to want to follow the undulations of whatever you attach it too, ceilings are by far the worst for this as they cast light shadows that will show every imperfection. Also the thinner sheets have more moisture issues on ceilings as that is where all the heat goes, again often making them kinda wavy.
If you really want to go ahead with 1/4" or 3/8" make sure you don't stray outside of a min. of 12" spacing on screws and use a moisture barrier primer (Zinsser, Kills) to help limit the amount of moisture absorbed by the thin drywall.

I often use thin drywall on curved walls, custom islands etc... or over the top of 1/2" drywall when we do attached garage additions to comply with fire code.

[Bster13]

Furring Strips

Ok, all good info, especially the moisture blocking primer.

In order to keep the ceiling level, with thin drywall, I might use 3/4in furring strips mounting directly to the underside of the ceiling joists (possibly w/ the plaster in between or not, not sure).

This would give a level surface to mount the drywall to, and then that 3/4 allowance would allow the stucco/popcorn to "live" in between the ceiling joist and the new, thin drywall. The furring strips could be shimmed as well.

Decent plan of attack?

[pushkins]

I wouldn't recommend removing any plaster to get the furring strips on the underside of the ceiling joist, the problem here is that almost always in older (plaster homes) the joists were as straight as a bent bow, it was the plasters job to float it out nice and flat. Often you'll find plaster ranging from 1/4" to 1".
If you want to use the furring idea, simply scrape back the popcorn over the joists then screw the furring strips into the joists flat against the plaster.

[Bster13]

Ok, I hear you on the plaster...leave it and just knock down the popcorn.

The last question I have is about recessed lighting.

I purchased 5 of these:

"Halo 4 in. LED New Construction Recessed Lighting Housing"

And 5 of these:

"EcoSmart 4 in. 9.5-Watt (65W) LED Downlight"

The plan is to cut out a wide berth in the plaster, in the general area where I am putting the recessed cans. Mount the cans, then put up the drywall (mounting to furring strips attached to the plaster under the joists).

My worry about this scenario is with the extra depth of the plaster/furring/drywall that the somewhat adjustable can (mounted flush with the bottom of the ceiling joist) won't be able to extend down enough to mount the LED bulb w/ integrated lip over the drywall, low enough.

I wouldn't recommend removing any plaster to get the furring strips on the underside of the ceiling joist, the problem here is that almost always in older (plaster homes) the joists were as straight as a bent bow, it was the plasters job to float it out nice and flat. Often you'll find plaster ranging from 1/4" to 1".
If you want to use the furring idea, simply scrape back the popcorn over the joists then screw the furring strips into the joists flat against the plaster.

[pushkins]

As long as the new construction cans come down to the new ceiling level you should have no problems installing the LED downlight attachments.
Did you consider buying remodel cans and cut them in after the ceiling remodel to the same locations might save you a ton of work, you can pull the wires out now, install the new ceiling (pulling the wires down through it) then cut in the new lights ?

[Bster13]

Well I bought the new construction cans because I believed they were more sturdy. Granted the cans around going to be touched or moved around, but I figured they would work better if I could get them into location.

Halo makes both air-tight pre-construction and air-tight post-construction cans, but both of them have the potential problem.... if the plaster plus the 3/4in furring strip is too thick, the can won't be able to adjust down enough to mount flush with the drywall, right?

I have a Home Depot 2 min from my house, I guess I can buy both pre and post and see which one work better.

As long as the new construction cans come down to the new ceiling level you should have no problems installing the LED downlight attachments.
Did you consider buying remodel cans and cut them in after the ceiling remodel to the same locations might save you a ton of work, you can pull the wires out now, install the new ceiling (pulling the wires down through it) then cut in the new lights ?

[Nestor]

Maybe try spraying some water on that popcorn with a spray bottle, giving the water some time to be absorbed into the popcorn texture and then try scraping it off with a paint scraper. I've heard that popcorn texture can be removed more easily if you get it a bit damp.