Curtain rods pulling anchors out of walls. Need lots of advice.

[MacRoss]

I'm getting desperate. I have three curtain rods hung throughout my rental home, and they are all starting to pull out of the walls. Let me explain my installation issues:

Back in February, I used an electronic stud finder to avoid studs while installing the plastic drywall screw anchors. This was a frustrating and tiring experience since holes I drilled, regardless of where the studs seemed to be, would stop taking the anchors about 3/4 of the way in and bend and break under the hammer. This in itself was maddening. After several holes and finally getting anchors in, I eventually gave up and drilled some screws directly into the wall. This also failed because when I drilled in, the screws (I think they're about 3" long) would go in until about a half an inch of screw was sticking out of the wall, and then stop. Even with all my force behind the drill, the screws remained partially out.

After lots of toil, I eventually got them in and flat, some with anchors and some without.

Now, the curtain is behind a couch, and I have two dachshunds who often sit on the back of it and nose opened the curtain to see out the window. Sometimes they end up on part of the curtain, pulling it slightly. This has seriously increased the rate of pull, and now only three or four screws are still in the wall. The ones that have fallen out were all on the plastic anchors, and they slide in and out of their holes easily now. I've noticed similar but far less dramatic pulling in other rooms where I've had similar issues getting anything to stay in the wall. This led me to believe the dogs were not the outright cause, but simply accelerated the pulling.

This has caused me a lot of frustration and my wife is insisting that I'm doing it wrong, even though I've followed directions both on the rods and from some DIY sites on the net. She's also fed up and even suggested just duct taping them to the wall (I hope she was kidding).

I'm at a loss. I need to repair the holes, get the <expletive> rod brackets to stay up firmly, and make sure they don't pull out of the wall again.

As a side note, the curtain rod brackets have two holes set vertically about 3"-4" inches apart, and the screws need to be put through them into the wall. This means I can't drive a heavier duty bracket into the wall and then place the brackets on the screws.

Sorry for the text wall, but I need help desperately!

EDIT: Oh, the brackets are for a curtain with a sheer drape as well, so each bracket has one thinner and one thicker rod giving them significant (but not terribly heavy) weight.

[The Builder]

You mentioned that you were able to get screws and the anchors in, but the anchors are the ones giving you the problem. Depending on the condition of the wall and the size of the brackets, take out the plastic anchors and put screws in place as you did for the other screws at the first that still remain and hold.

[HayZee518]

if you are sure the wall is sheetrock, they make a wall anchor specifically for sheetrock. if it a very coarse thread anchor with a self drilling tip. locate where you want the anchor, use a phillips screwdriver in the center of the anchor, press hard and firmly and screw in the anchor. once the anchor bottoms out remove the screwdriver and use a sheetrock screw or sheet metal screw to hold your curtain rod bracket to the anchor. usually two per curtain rod.

[MacRoss]

The Builder: Yes, but even those are starting to pull out of the other walls. Only about 1/4" or so, but I've noticed it. Additionally, the anchors have left a hole about the width of a pencil, significantly wider than the screws. Would I be able to patch a hole like that and put a screw back in or would I need to move the hole after patching? HayZee: The wall looks to be either a drywall or a plaster of some sort. I have a feeling sheetrock anchors would cause more harm than good.

[HayZee518]

sounds like an unusual place for a curtain rod to be fastened - directly to sheetrock. aren't they normally fastened to the top of the window casing or top molding?

[The Builder]

First you should find out what type of wall framing and wall finish you have, that way you will know what type of fastener is best. At least try to find out what type of wall finish you have. You mentioned that the holes were pencil size, try to stick a bent hanger inside the hole to see if its hollow in back of the wall finish to try to determine what wall system is behind the wall finish and to atleast get an idea of what your working with. Alot of times plastic anchors work for me, but each job can have a different situation.

[mrcaptainbob]

Wall anchor....

Usually there's lots of 2x4's around the window perimeter under and close to the molding. I'd use screws directly into that wood. Use 2 1/2" screws and they won't pull out. The plastic anchors you're using are not good enough for that application. HayZee suggested the large anchors that are driven in using your drill with a phillips bit in it. Some of those are rated at 90#'s pull. Try those. They are available at any hardware store. I could hang myself from three of them!

[MacRoss]

Usually there's lots of 2x4's around the window perimeter under and close to the molding. I'd use screws directly into that wood. Use 2 1/2" screws and they won't pull out. The plastic anchors you're using are not good enough for that application. HayZee suggested the large anchors that are driven in using your drill with a phillips bit in it. Some of those are rated at 90#'s pull. Try those. They are available at any hardware store. I could hang myself from three of them!

I'd love to hang them directly into the 2x4s, but I can't seem to locate them consistently. Even using a stud finder, I keep ending up with vacant air behind the screws in the wall.

[pushkins]

On either side of all windows is a form of lumber material (2x4 etc...), same goes for across the top and whole length of the window. The top (header) is easy to find as it most always will be 2x8" sized or larger so it's easy to find and gives you plenty of space to screw directly into it.
On either side of the window sometimes can be a little challenging as it depends on the allowances the framer gave for the window rough in, I have seen them up to 3" from the actual window's frame (bad framer) on either side of the window there (usually) is two pieces of wood, one is called a "jack" and holds up the header that supports the weight over the window, the other is called a king and runs tight against the jack and all the way up to the top of the wall.
So with standard window trim molding (2 1/2") you should still be able to get a screw into some wood right close to the trim.

[The Builder]

Actually there is not always wood framing around windows. Certain times the windows are installed with special anchors that attach to masonry. A number of window installers may be familar with the ols aluminum windows, that are very troublesome to take out

[pushkins]

Something has to hold the header and every 16" there must be a stud. Jacks are not allowed to stand alone and must be accompanied by a king. I am familiar with masonry anchored windows and regardless of these types of windows a header must be in place, to carry the/any load therefor insuring a jack and king very nearby.

[The Builder]

A masonry structure don't need a wood header. It can be metal just to support the bricks and so on. Alot of new houses are framed out with wood and have a brick or other masonry veneer, but a number of old houses that were made of brick didn't have framing as is the case today. A number of them have interior partitions that are framed, and a number of them even have wood blocks between the bricks at different locations to fasten windows and doors but no framing

[pushkins]

Your correct, up until 1928 there was no code specifically set for header support over windows or doors on " Cavity Brick" building, cavity brick being two layer of brick work usually with plaster over the inner layer to give a finished wall. However, even then wood blocks were placed in the cavity wall to allow attachment of finish material like trim and curtain holding material.
One was placed at either end of the window (same place as jacks/kings were placed) and more than not at least one in the center of the opening.
These were specifically placed to allow attachment of finishing material. Builders back hen ( assuming this home was built back then) worked with the next trade in mind, that is, the mason always had in mind the carpenter and his needs, the carpenter always had in mind the plumber and so on. Unlike today where the framer comes in does his job...then the plumber...then the electrician...etc...etc... and none care about the next trade's job, mainly causethey are not there to hear the complaints , unless the GC is there to ensure some sort of cohesiveness.