Moving gas supply line for stove

[gk1]

I need to move the line for my stove over 1 foot, since I redesigned my kitchen, and the supply comes in right in the middle of the stove now. I had this professionally done a few months back, and was prepared to have someone come out after I couldn't completely dis-assemble the fitting at the floor, but they have stood me up today, and I am really loathe to pay $100 for 10 min of work, when I know I could do it myself.

Anyway, I have flexible gas line coming in from the crawl space below, into a series of adaptors behind the stove. At issue is the fact that at the bottom is a wide disk used to secure the whole set to the floor. Connected to this disk is a female fitting. When I dis-assembled myself, I found the flexible tubing to be flared-out. This prevented the removal of the female fitting (which itself was attatched to the large mounting disk). Make sense? it looks something like this:

]
][==(
]

the ] is the disk
the [ is the female fitting
the = is the gas line
the ( represents the flare.

Anyway, any suggestions on how to get the female fitting/disk off the flexible line, so I can remove the disk, and then pass the flex-line down and then up through the floor again? Thanks
gk

[gk1]

OK that was easy. I found this:

http://www.omegaflex.com/trac/litlibrary/TracPipe_DI_Guide_July_2004.pdf

which is an in-detail description of flexible supply line connectors. I guess it is a flange mount auto-flare connection, so it needed to but cut again, and the split rings put back in below the cut. When you tighten, the flex tubing flares out, forming a new tight connection.

[LazyPup]

GK1
There are a number of code violations that would prevent us from advising you how to connect the gas line in the manner you suggest.

1.A flexible gas connector line MAY NOT pass through any floor, wall, partition (ceiling) or appliance housing (International Residential Code 2422.1.2) (Uniform Plumbing Code 1212.0X2).

2.An accessible gas shutoff valve MUST BE within 6' of the appliance(IRC 2420.5) (UPC-Must be within 3" of the appliance UPC 1211.18)

3.Valve shall be readily accessible (within the same room as the appliance) (IRC2420.1.3) (UPC 1211.18)

4. Flexible gas line connectors MUST BE connected immediately after the shutoff valve (IRC 2422.1.2) (UPC 1212.OX3)

5. Aluminum connectors may have NO CONTACT with masonary, insulation or plaster (UPC 2422.1.1) (IRC1212.OX5)

[gk1]

I am referring in the post, and in my original, to the flexible gas line described here:

http://www.askthebuilder.com/296_Flexible_Gas_Lines-_Are_You_Serious_.shtml

and NOT to the flexible gas line that attaches to the stove.


In specific answer to your concerns:

1.A flexible gas connector line MAY NOT pass through any floor, wall, partition (ceiling) or appliance housing (International Residential Code 2422.1.2) (Uniform Plumbing Code 1212.0X2).
--Well, I don't see how else you are gonna get gas into the house, since the floor, ceiling, and wall pretty much covers everything. To be complete, the flexible gas supply line passes through the floor, into the flange mount auto-flare adaptor, which is attached to the floor. Again, if you didn't know, flexible gas supply lines (corregated stainless steel tubing-CSST) are code and are used -instead of- iron piping.

2.An accessible gas shutoff valve MUST BE within 6' of the appliance(IRC 2420.5) (UPC-Must be within 3" of the appliance UPC 1211.18).
--The shut-off valve is attached to the flange mount auto-flare adaptor, sitting behind the stove.

3.Valve shall be readily accessible (within the same room as the appliance) (IRC2420.1.3) (UPC 1211.18)
--it is behind the stove...

4. Flexible gas line connectors MUST BE connected immediately after the shutoff valve (IRC 2422.1.2) (UPC 1212.OX3)
The flexible gas line connector -to the stove- is attached to the shut-off valve.

5. Aluminum connectors may have NO CONTACT with masonry, insulation or plaster (UPC 2422.1.1) (IRC1212.OX5)
--??

[LazyPup]

You are correct that CSST is approved for gas,,but may only be run under slab if it is run through a schdule 40 iron or PVC conduit,,and may not be used for distribution within the structure,,,the transition for CSST to pipe must occur within 6" of finish grade,,,and that is only approved if accepted by local code per manufacturers instructions.

[gk1]

Well, there is no question: I don't fully know the code.

BUT, I am sure that the CSST does not need to be run in conduit to be used. This would simply defeat the purpose of using it: the relative ease of use. Taking the quote from the website referenced above:

"The CSST has many advantages. Perhaps the biggest one is labor savings. Traditional black iron pipe takes a lot of time to cut and thread. I know as I have installed thousands of linear feet of the heavy material. As you said, the new CSST is installed like electrical wire. You simply pull the material between two points and cut it to length with simple tubing cutters. Black iron pipe is the exact opposite. A typical black iron pipe installation requires a professional to precisely measure, cut, and thread the individual pieces of pipe. All of these steps are very time consuming."

If you had to run conduit to run the flex, then why would you even bother?

I had my gas line hooked up by a professional installer, and that is what they used. I had three other quotes, and that is what they were going to use. Nowhere in any of the quotes was conduit mentioned.

Reading on code from the TracPipe installation guide:

Depending on local building codes and construction
practice, Flexible gas piping can be
routed:

1. Beneath floor joists, through floor and ceiling
joists, along side of floor and ceiling
joists. This is the typical location for residences
and commercial buildings with
basements and for multi-floor systems.

4. Through approved conduit under ground
or under building slabs. When piping runs
are located below grade or under a concrete
slab, the TracPipe shall be routed
within a non-metallic water-tight conduit.

Also, there is an entry talking about supporting TracPipe:

SUPPORTING TRACPIPE
Piping shall be supported in a workmanlike
manner with pipe straps, bands,
brackets or hangers suitable for the size
and weight of the piping.

...Which would be unnecessary if it was running in conduit.


NOTE that I am not talking about running the stuff through a slab. I never mentioned this. It just runs under the house, as was installed. All I did was move the existing line 1 foot over.

[LazyPup]

All gas piping regardless of what material when run under a slab is required to be run through a conduit and the said conduit is required to be sealed on the interior end and have a vent above grade on the exterior end.

The information that you cited from the website is the manufacturers recommendatoins but does not reflect the specificationa as set forth by ASME (American Society of Mechanical Engineers) ASTM (American Society of Testing & Materials) or ANSI (American National Standards Institute) nor does it reflect the current limitations as secified by the Inernational Plumbing Code, Uniform Plumbing Code or state and local codes.

You will also note that artice 4 of the manufacturers specifications also states it must run in conduit under slab.

The BOCA plumbing code does permit limited and specific use for distribution on an individual job, but only with the expressed written permission of the local inspecting authority and only when the said installation is protected on all sides from physical abuse.

In my experience that said written approval has only been granted for a riser from underslab up to a boiler, furnace of other HVAC device, and only when concealed in a conduit.

[gk1]

All gas piping regardless of what material when run under a slab is required to be run through a conduit and the said conduit is required to be sealed on the interior end and have a vent above grade on the exterior end.

But I'm not running under a slab!

"Corrugated stainless steel gas tubing (CSST) consists of a continuous, flexible, stainless steel pipe with an exterior PVC covering..... It is most often installed in a central manifold configuration (also called parallel configuration) with "home run" lines that extend to gas appliances. Flexible gas piping is lightweight and requires fewer connections than traditional gas piping because it can be bent easily and routed around obstacles."

http://www.toolbase.org/docs/MainNav/NewBuildingTechnologies/2079_gaspipe.html

[LazyPup]

I am fully familiar with the standards and regulations regarding the use and installation of CSST pipe, however, while the manufacture has made a number claims in regards to its use, the codes have not adopted those standards.

Although I have run a considerable amount of CSST on government projects on military installations, I would not recommend it in the residential enviroment for a number of reasons.

1. Most local codes have not yet adopted it use, and of the majority that have, they require it to be fully enclosed in either a conduit or chase.

2. It requires special code approved tools to cut the pipe and set the fittings. ( the last set of CSST tools I purchaed cost $800 for the set.)

3. both the codes and manufacturers specifications state it may only be installed by certified contractors (in most areas where i have seen it used even a bona-fide apprentice may not make connections under the supervision of a master unless they have previously had the required classroom training.)

4. Fittings cannot be re-used and fittings are NOT to be sold to the general public. Only to authorized contractors.

My personal greatest reservation in the use of CSST in the residential enviroment is the same as my reservation to run PEX for water supply. While these products are a great time saver to the original installer, and therefore equate a greater margin of profit, the requirements to adhere to a number of non-traditional code standards and the necessity to use very expensive tools and equipment makes it nearly impossible for the homeowner to perform code approved routine service or maintenance on these systems. Failure to use the code approved tools or techniques on any single fitting on the system, negates code approval on the entire system.

[gk1]

Well, it is code in my area, for use in residential applications, and does not require any conduit. I am sure there are many areas where it is not allowed. I found the stuff easy to work with.

[LazyPup]

GK1
How were you able to cut it and set the fittings?