Replacing Main Water Shutoff Valve

[Rwh56]

I would like to replace the old valves that control the main water line inside the house. There are two, one street side of the meter, and the other house side of the meter. The house side valve has tubing that does not look like modern copper tube sweated joints. Is there anything I need to know to install a new valve on this type of tubing. The tubing is connected to modern copper tubes further inside the house, so I suppose I can saw off the old valve and replace the unusual looking tubing with modern copper tubing. Any advice is appreciated.

Rob

[mrcaptainbob]

Replacement tubing....

I'll bet that if you'd scrub that valve body and the tubes connected to it with a wire brush that you'd find the valve is brass and that tubing is copper. Also, scrub the lower end of the vertical portion and see where the change is from sweated copper to the threaded iron tee fitting....

[HayZee518]

valves

is the street side valve a globe valve or a gate valve? the lines look like 3/4" hard [maybe type M] copper the tee at the bottom is galvanized and will cause you problems in the future. the meter body is bronze or brass. galvanized and brass don't like each other. the downstream valve looks like a gate valve, threaded. you don't want galvanized and copper anyplace.

[LazyPup]

It appears that the line coming into the house is GIP(Galvanized Iron Pipe) and the valve on the street side of the meter (lower left) is a gate valve. It should also be noted that placing a valve on the street side of the meter is an option, and not required by code.

As was previously mentioned by Hayzee, the meter body is bronze. The two short horizontal nipples on either side of the meter are also bronze and given that code will allow a 6" hardened bronze nipple to be use as a dielectric fitting to transition from GIP to copper all is well to that point.

That tee at the base of the riser appears to be a GIP tee, which is incorrect, however I do not understand why there is tee there anyway. It leaves the implication that perhaps they intended to attach another line there for some purpose in future, but code prohibits attaching a line there. Code requires that we install the house "Main Water Shutoff Valve" on the house side of the meter and all lines, whether they are main or branch lines must be attached on the house or downstream side of the main water shutoff valve. I suspect that when they originally installed that tee it was one of those situations where it was late in the day and the installer didn't have a copper or brass tee, so he/she erroneously stuck a GIP tee with a plug to use in place of a copper elbow.

The fitting on the top of the elbow is an old (antique) MIP x sweat copper thread adapter and that valve is also an antique gate valve. In fact, that valve is so old I doubt if you could even get it to turn if you needed to turn the water off.

The question then becomes, how do we replace that valve?

First off, let me make on point perfectly clear. NEVER CUT COPPER PIPE WITH A SAW! There is only .001" clearance between the OD of copper pipe and the ID of a solder fitting. If you cut copper pipe with a saw you run a very high risk of getting the pipe out of round, and with only .001" of clearance if the pipe is even minimally out of round you will never be able to properly make up the joint. Copper pipe MUST always be cut with a pipe or tubing cutter. With that close clearance to the wall it would be difficult to rotate a conventional tubing cutter so I would suggest using a good quality "Mini-cutter". Here is also a trick. Before you cut the copper get a piece of emery cloth about 2" wide and 6" to 10" long. Loop the emery cloth around the pipe, then holding both ends of the cloth work it back and forth like as shoe shine rag to clean the pipe before cutting. It is much easier to clean when it is still rigid rather than working with a loose end.

Now if you have good soldering skills you may want to cut the pipe above that valve then remove everything down to and including that tee. You could then put a copper female thread adapter on the nipple from the meter and a copper elbow to turn vertical up to your new valve.

On the other hand, if you are not comfortable with soldering vertical copper joints there is another option. As long as that existing valve remains open it functions solely as a short length of pipe and if it is not leaking there is no real reason the it must be cut out. Furthermore, this is an exposed location so there is nothing preventing you from using compression fittings instead of soldering. You could simply cut out a section of the pipe and install a compression type ball valve and be done, although if you elect to leave the existing valve in place, I would suggest removing the handle so no one would be tempted to disturb it in future.