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I have been reading a lot about Geothermal heat pumps to heat and cool your house. I went to the local home show yesterday and out of about 8 vendors that deal with HVAC, only one had any interest in answering my questions about installation. One indicated that the system is too expensive and that I would be back to a regular airconditioner. It seems to me that the equipment is simpler than an AC unit and the only hard part is the tubing that goes in the ground. Since I have a backhoe, that seems doable. Any opinions out there?[?]
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If you are going to be in the home for 10 years go for it.
Go look at http://www.amgeo.com Dont mess with the water kind
ED
My mistakes dont define me they inform me.My mistakes dont define me they inform me. -
jchealy,,While geothermal is a relatively old technology they are just now gaining popularity, therefore most installers have had very little to no hands on experience with them.
I had my first opportunity to install one in 1983 and have done quite a few since then, three of which were on my own homes. I would not even consider installing a heat pump in my house unless it was on a geothermal ground loop. Conventional air exchange heat pumps have tooo many headackes by comparison.Comment
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what is effect of radon levels in the home when using a geothermal systemComment
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Geothermal heating and cooling have absolutely no effect on the Radon levels in a home.
Radon is a gas that can leach through cracks and crevices in a foundation to enter the home, but it is easily shielded.
A geothermal heat pump uses a long continuos closed loop of pipe which is buried in the soil to circulate a brine mix of water and antifreeze. The water is pumped through the loop where it either absorbs heat from the soil during the heating cycle, or releases heat into the soil during the cooling cycle.
The water in the closed loop is passed through a heat exchanger in the geothermal machinery space where the heat is transferred from the water to the refrigerant in the heating and cooling system.
The water in the geothermal ground loop is no circulated within the home.
Radon is a radioactive gas which is found natural in the soil in some regions and can permeat through openings in a foundation or basement wall but it cannot penetrate through the wall of the pipe used to make the geothermal loop.Comment
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Or if you just like take the condenser coil off the heat pump you have now and bury it . You will have a GeoDX heatpump. No pump or water in it. Well almost
My mistakes dont define me they inform me.My mistakes dont define me they inform me.Comment
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We went to the home show at the fair grounds. There were about 10 vendors there that were selling HVAC units. None of them had installed any geothermal units. Two said they were too expensive and not worth the work. I did not feel that any had the experience to work with me. Since I own a backhoe, I could bury the pipe to collect the ground temp. The rest is just plumbing. Ok, a little more than that.
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Fotr sure you have to be EPA
ED
My mistakes dont define me they inform me.My mistakes dont define me they inform me.Comment
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We installed a geothermal system in our house when we built it 7 years ago and I wouldn't build another house without one. We absolutely love it!
The estimated payback time was 10-12 years, but we had 3 extremely hot summers and it was paid for in 5 years. We are now banking about $200 a month that would otherwise be used for heating and cooling.
Here in Texas, the roar of AC units is something you learn to put up with, but with our geothermal system, we sit on the patio on a summer evening and listen to the mockingbirds, instead of AC fans.
There is no maintenance except to change air filters and so far, the unit has been trouble free. Another bonus is that it pre-heats water going into our water heater.Comment
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There is most definitely maintenence to do on this and every other system out there. If changing the filter is all thats been done in the last 5 years, you're already behind. You may have a circulator pump that doesn't need to be oiled (permanently lubricated or water lubricated) but these manufacturers spec out end play and other tolerances to their pumps, and when those tolerances are exceeded, the pump has to be replaced. What's the condition of the condenser's tube-sheet bundle? Is there any scaling? Does the glycol mix still have the correct percentage of protection additives, both freeze and boil- and anti scaling additive? These factors have to be measured at least annually, and even if nothing is needed to be done, the results of the tests will give the technician a means to evaluate the overall system and an idea of when pump failure will occur, when additive needs to be placed in the system, when a rodding\brushing of the condenser's water passages will need to be performed. Or should you just run it into the ground where you're getting your energy savings from? No maintenence, and you'll break down on the hottest or coldest day of the year-where you can put back that 5 year energy savings real quick, from having to use an alternate fuel source.
This is just my opinion, and with it and a dollar, you can get a cup of coffee in most places.Comment
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I'm only quoting what the installer said. I questioned what maintenance needed to be done and he said "none". If it fails, give us a call.quote:Originally posted by heatmon
There is most definitely maintenence to do on this and every other system out there. If changing the filter is all thats been done in the last 5 years, you're already behind. You may have a circulator pump that doesn't need to be oiled (permanently lubricated or water lubricated) but these manufacturers spec out end play and other tolerances to their pumps, and when those tolerances are exceeded, the pump has to be replaced. What's the condition of the condenser's tube-sheet bundle? Is there any scaling? Does the glycol mix still have the correct percentage of protection additives, both freeze and boil- and anti scaling additive? These factors have to be measured at least annually, and even if nothing is needed to be done, the results of the tests will give the technician a means to evaluate the overall system and an idea of when pump failure will occur, when additive needs to be placed in the system, when a rodding\brushing of the condenser's water passages will need to be performed. Or should you just run it into the ground where you're getting your energy savings from? No maintenence, and you'll break down on the hottest or coldest day of the year-where you can put back that 5 year energy savings real quick, from having to use an alternate fuel source.
This is just my opinion, and with it and a dollar, you can get a cup of coffee in most places.Comment
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Needless to say, the idea that I might be neglecting required servicing on my equipment, I called the company that installed our geothermal unit originally. They again said there was no maintenance required other than filter changes.
I then asked about the specifics mentioned in heatmon's post. The suggested I talk to an expert, so they gave me the name of the Engineer/owner of a consulting firm that designs all of their systems.
He also stated there are no maintenance requirements in our part of the country, since an anti-freeze solution is not used.
He also mentioned that the latest designs are up to 20% more efficient than my unit, but the price of conversion would only make sense if I have a major failure. A 20% savings with normal weather would put me back on a 10 year payback.Comment
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Last summer, we re-modeled over half our existing house, and added on an addition 90% of the size of our existing house. We also installed geothermal heat, using an open loop (pump and dump) we were originally going to pump the discharge water back down our old well, but it would not take the water, so we now dump it down a drain which leads to a field tile that we tested would take well over 15 gpm, for hours. This unit is limited to 6 gpm so that is no problem at all. We have not experienced any lack of water, even on the coldest days of winter, or the hottest days of summer.
We are very pleased with the performance of the unit. It can quickly heat/cool the house well beyond room temperature no problem. It has a backup electric heat unit that mounts right above the blower fan in the unit. The water heater pre-heat is also very nice, as that water can get HOT.
We also are in the process of purchasing a wood burning fireplace that will be installed right in front of our main return grille. That way, we can just turn the unit on fan only, and circulate the heat from the woodburner through the rest of our house.
I'm not sure on the specifics, but since we had no central air before, and cable heat in the ceilings, this was a good move in our situation.
~Jonathon Reinhart
~Jonathon ReinhartComment
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Kidd6488 If you can Id change over to a ground loop there. Down the road when you use a well to well or as you a well to a drain there is to much build up in the coils with the lime and calcium that you have to clean out all the time. Thays why we find it best to go DXGeo with just the freon lines in the ground. No water or water pumps
ED just my .02 cents
My mistakes dont define me they inform me.My mistakes dont define me they inform me.Comment
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